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Super Admin.
Post: #261947
PT: #16/45
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[i][b]He took Garvin to court and LOST!!
and what was cool about that is that the judge asked Fuller how Garvin got the belt and Fuller had to kayfabe and say he "won" it...case closed!
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Member
Post: #262855
PT: #18/45
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Is it just me or has Bob Roop "left" or sued or went up against just about ever promoter he ever worked for?
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| When our memories outweigh our dreams, we have grown old.
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Post: #262899
PT: #19/45
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This message was edited by lasvegasleglock on June 23rd, 2005 03:00 GMT
I'm interested in the answer to Cyber's question, but....
To Izzy and Yellowdog---
God, I'd LOVE to get a transcript of that court case. I'll bet we'd split a gut reading that!!!!!
"He took my boat!"
Judge: How did he get it?
"I put it up in a match and I let him pin me!"
God, Fuller's lawyer must've been pissed. Losing a case due to Kayfabe.
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| "You don't have an army. If you want to have an army, you need a capable leader. Not an IDIOT like YOU!" - Masked Superstar to Gene Anderson
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Topics: 11
Replies: 875
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Post: #263037
PT: #20/45
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I dont know about his lawyer but Im sure Fuller must have been pissed( and rightfully so when you think about it lol). As for splitting a gut.everytime a group of us boys hung out on the boat at Norris Lake we all had a pretty good time and laugh at Fullers expense.
Seriously though you have to appreciate Fullers dilema. Had he not kept kayfabe he probaly would have gotten his boat back But he would have put his business at great risk.Fullers promotion at the time was extremly succesful drawing sellout crowds weeklly both in the home city Knoxville and also several other weekly and spot shows.
Take care,
Izzy
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Post: #263220
PT: #21/45
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The fact that Ronnie kept the boat says a lot about his true character.....from a moral point of view it was nothing more than grand theft pure and simple, if Garvin had a problem with the pay there were legal avenues for him also.
I ain't taking sides here, Fuller was a wrestling promoter and that makes him very very suspect at best but to take someone else's property like Ronnie did makes him no better.
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| When our memories outweigh our dreams, we have grown old.
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Topics: 30
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Post: #263768
PT: #22/45
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Well, let's remember, too, from the Bob Roop posts, how there were suspicions of "ripoffs" already flying around, and total lack of trust and respect. Those who didn't "like it" seemed to have been thrown overboard before they could quit.
While Garvin may have taken advantage of the situation, there were so many hard feelings that you can see all sides.
Fuller was obviously pissed because promoters and bookers always got the last laugh. He obviously didn't. 
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| "You don't have an army. If you want to have an army, you need a capable leader. Not an IDIOT like YOU!" - Masked Superstar to Gene Anderson
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Topics: 11
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Post: #263835
PT: #23/45
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Don't make assumptions about the character of a man you don't know.
Ronnie Garvin is a man of fine character.Only the men who were involved know the intimate details of why and how things happened the way they did and bear in mind that something must have been the catalyst for men like Ronnie Garvin, Bob Roop, Bob Orton Jr, Prof. Boris Malenko and Ron Wright (and there were others who said they would join but changed their minds at the last minute) to defect and take the risk of running opposition to an established promotion.
take care,
Izzy
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Post: #263879
PT: #24/45
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Quoted from: izzyslap, June 28th, 2005 03:00 GMTDon't make assumptions about the character of a man you don't know.
Ronnie Garvin is a man of fine character.Only the men who were involved know the intimate details of why and how things happened the way they did and bear in mind that something must have been the catalyst for men like Ronnie Garvin, Bob Roop, Bob Orton Jr, Prof. Boris Malenko and Ron Wright (and there were others who said they would join but changed their minds at the last minute) to defect and take the risk of running opposition to an established promotion.
take care,
Izzy
My only point was, that Ronnie and others had legal avenues to get what they felt was coming to them.....by taking the boat, he lowered himself to the level of the people he thought screwed him. And with that said, that makes me question his character.
And, I'm still waiting on comments from anyone about the fact that Roop has "questioned", "accused", or "gone up against" just about every promoter he ever worked for.
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Member
Post: #264010
PT: #25/45
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What was a sellout in Knoxville? I've read results for Chatanooga that drew over 5,000. How did the Tri-Cities draw?
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Post: #264105
PT: #26/45
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This message was edited by izzyslap on June 29th, 2005 22:11 GMT
Cyber , unfortunatly there wern't any legal solutions for our problems with promoters in the territory days. Contracts were non -exisistant and we were at the mercy of the promoters who paid us what they wanted when they wanted(some promoters were fine individuals who took care of us and treated us fairly and some wern't). By speaking up an individual ran the risk of loosing his job and possibly being partially blackballed( I say partially because not all promoters would join in the punishment). The only way to prtoect opurselves many times was for us to stick together and stick it to those who tried to stick us,
As for my good friend Bon Roop he cerainly DID NOT go up against, question or accuse every promoer he worked for. He got along well with many. Almost all of the boys in ICW had problems with Angelo and many of the boys working for the Fullers had problems with them hence the defection.
I hope this helped, take care,
Izzy
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Post: #264208
PT: #27/45
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Thanks for your input Izzy...
I value your opnion and we are most honored you take the time to participate here.
I got to see lots of K town action in 77-79. I left before the defection so I did not know what happened only that it happened. I picked up Ron's Dothan promotion in late 80 to mid 84.
I understand the guys having to do what they had to do, but from an economical stand point did working for ICW at "full pay" pay as much as SECW "skimmed pay"? I didn't think ICW drew houses that were as large as the Knoxville gorup.
And I still don't think Ronnie should have taken the boat Whip Ron's ass or something but not take the boat. 
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Post: #264670
PT: #28/45
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I can't speak for Izzy, Ronnie, Bob Roop, etc.....
But if you were promised a deal (X % of the house) and you suspect you're being lied to, getting less $$$....which means THEY are keeping YOUR money from themselves)....
Pride probably steps in. Better to have an honest day's pay where everyone knows the score, than know you are being ripped off. Maybe cutting off your nose to spite your face, but I can see how you could go there.
Moreso....as we know now....SE was not exactly solvent, since it changed hands so often after 1978. So maybe, to Orton/Roop/Garvin, it didn't seem risky or like a pay-cut. Fuller bought and sold that thing a couple of times (including the Mulligan-Flair era) so it obviously wasn't exactly a license to print money.
Maybe, after that, they burnt wrestlers on their guarantees to pay off that boat!
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| "You don't have an army. If you want to have an army, you need a capable leader. Not an IDIOT like YOU!" - Masked Superstar to Gene Anderson
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Member
Post: #265502
PT: #29/45
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working for ICW was never a financial windfall lol.
Take care,
Izzy
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 fan70s |
March 11th, 2006 05:37 GMT |
 
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Post: #302273
PT: #30/45
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Quoted from: The Destroying Angel, December 03rd, 2004 05:34 GMThttp://www.geocities.com/canadianwrestlemedia/Eastcan3.htm
In 1977, Halifax promoter Al Zinck was in a promotional war with the Kay brothers' (Leo Burke, The Beast, Rudy & Bobby Kay) and (I think) Emile Dupre's Trans-Canada group. Most of the talent in the Maritimes traditionally came from other Canadian territories, but it looks like Zinck probably took a hit there, as many top names stuck with the Kays.
That spring and summer a lot of Tennessee area talent came to work for Zinck. Tommy Gilbert, Rick and Robert Gibson, Don Fargo, Buzz Sawyer, Don Carson, David Schultz, Terry Gordy, Dennis Condrey, Phil Hickerson and others hit Nova Scotia rings. I notice that Eastern Canadian regular Len Shelley showed up in Tennessee around the same time, and if I'm not mistaken the Great Malumba did a lot of work in the South in the 70s as Prince Kumali.
I'm not sure how the Maritimes war worked out, but it ended with Zinck folding and Dupre running a new entity called Atlantic Grand Prix Wrestling in 1978. I guess somebody kept a pipeline open between Nova Scotia and Tennessee, as several of the wrestlers returned, and Carpetbagger brought along his sons and other stars like Rip Rogers over the next couple of years. AGPW recognized the ICW World title, and I think Poffo and Savage were making title defenses there in 1980.
The biggest curiosity here is how did Zinck arrange for the Tennessee workers in the first place, who was his initial contact? The workers mentioned above weren't exclusive to any group, several of them wrestled for Jarrett, Gulas and Fuller around that time.
I think the link would have been Tommy Gilbert, who was brought into the Maritimes in 1976 (perhaps by the Kays) and given the North American Belt.
Here is a skeleton history of the promotions, of that era in the Maritimes:
In 1969 Al Zink and Rudy Kay formed Eastern Sports Association, their brand name was ‘International Wrestling’, ESA was considered the governing body until they joined the NWA. They ran cards six or seven nights a week across Nova Scotia and New Brunswick. The nightly cards were almost identical for the week, so they could be promoted by one TV show. The week would start Saturday nights in New Glasgow, the main stop was the Halifax Forum, every Tuesday night, followed by a TV taping Wed. Morning at the CJCH studios on Robie Street. This show, hosted by Clary Fleming would be broadcast across the Maritimes Saturday on the ATV network. Wrestling here was seasonal, they would start about the first of May, till about Oct., in the off-season, the wrestlers would work other territories, while working elsewhere the Cormiers (the Beast (Ivan), Rudy Kay,Leo Burke and Bobby Kay) would also scout and line up talent for the next season. During the off-season, ATV would show reruns, but around 73 they showed the Grand Prix Wrestling TV show from Montreal. When International Wrestling returned in the spring ATV broadcast both shows, and some Grand Prix Wrestlers came to the Maritimes under their banner, GP mostly appeared in small towns, stars of Montreal's GP would Main event the cards, with about 3 supporting matches, . I ASSUME, Dupree was their Maritime booker at the Start, and formed Atlantic Grand Prix Wrestling when the Original folded. They were not serious competition to IW, they had no local TV (none at all after GP folded), and did not appear in Halifax, until 78.
In 1975 ESA became a member of the NWA and Bobby Kay took over Rudy’s share of the promotion. In Oct 75, Jack Brisco defended the World Title against Leo Burke in Halifax, losing the only fall in the 2/3 fall match but keeping the title. In 76 Terry Funk did a one week tour of the Maritimes, defending against Leo Burke, in Halifax Funk got DQ’d.
Early 1977 ESA dispersed, the Cormiers kept the title belts and Zinck kept the ‘International Wrestling’ name and the TV show. Zinck made a deal with George Cannon, In the Spring of 1977, instead of International Wrestling reruns, they started showing Cannon’s “Canadian Wrestling” from Ontario, Luis Martinez was their Champion. When Al Zink started his season it was under the banner “Canadian International Wrestling”, with a new crew, including some from the Ontario show. Clary Flemming was joined by George Cannon as colour-man. The parent company was no longer ESA, but 'Maritime International Sports Ltd'.
The Cormiers formed “Trans-Canada Wrestling” with Promoter Bobby Kay, featuring the Beast, Leo Burke, Rudy Kay, Hubert Gallant, Giles Poisson, Frenchy Martin, John Quinn, a Masked Mauler and others. Zinck had the Form, so TCW held cards at the Centennial Arena in Fairview (a smaller arena on the outskirts of Hfx.) on Thursday nights, they had no regional TV show, but might still have made it, if not for a box office robbery on night of their biggest gate.
Back in IW, Cannon disappeared and ‘Canadian’ faded from the marque, Dennis Condry & Phil Hickerson came into the area as the World Tag Team Champions. Tommy Gilbert also appeared about this time. I attended a card near the end of summer (after the demise of TCW), the crowd was chanting “we want the Beast”, two weeks later the Beast was on the card. None of the other TCW stars went back with Zinck that year, but Gallant and the entire Cormier Clan returned with Zinck for the 1984 resurrection.
In the spring of 1978, Al Zinck announced that he would no longer be promoting wrestling. ATV gave Dupree his TV spot, AGPW’s International Champion that year was “Leaping” Lanny Poffo, Lanny lost the International title to Randy "Macho Man" Savage The North American Tag Team Champions were the Cuban Assassin & the Carpet Bagger (Angelo the relationship between the three Poffo's was Kayfabe). Savage was still champion at the end of season. Soon after this the Poffo’s started ICW, there Savage was billed as World Champion, the title’s history included Lanny credited for winning the title in San Francisco from Joe Banek and Savage's win over Lanny in Halifax, for AGPW’s International title, but I think they changed the date to 79.
When the 79 season started Killer Karl Krupp was International champion, credited with having beaten Savage somewhere. Lanny Poffo did return once or twice but Randy never did. The Cormiers first appeared on AGPW in 79.
In 1984 Zinck restarted International Wrestling for one year (with JJ Dillon as booker), and the Cormiers worked for him, and went back to AGPW the next year, about 1980 AGPW lost the TV spot.
The Cormiers may have worked your area, they sometimes used different names:
Romeo Cormier = Norton Jackson (rookie) Stampede and the Maritimes; Bobby Kay, Maritimes; Terry Martin, Central States; Terry Kay in Mid-Atlantic and Toronto; Bobby Burke, Stampede.
Leo Burke was Tommy Martin (CS) & Bobby Kay Mid-Atlantic.
The Beast was also Beast Martin; (rookie) Ivan the Timberjack.
Title listings for International and AGPW are at:
http://www.wrestling-titles.com/canada/maritimes/
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