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This message was edited by garretta on November 26th, 2023 22:10 GMT
This is a another in what I hope will be a long series of threads talking about preliminary wrestlers. In this thread, we'll examine some of out favorite jobbers in another setting: the house show, where they get more of an opportunity to show their skills and even pick up a win once in a while.
We open with a match featuring "The Number One Frenchman", Rene Goulet. It's Saturday. January 21, 1984 at the Spectrum in Philadelphia, and in the opening match, he takes on the man soon to be known as "Hot Stuff". Eddie Gilbert. Your announcers for PRISM are Gorilla Monsoon and Dick Graham:
1. In a nice touch taken from boxing, the rind announcer introduces the referee by name. He also gives the color of the wrestlers' trunks.
2. Gino outs over Eddie's recuperative powers as je talks about the legitimate car accident that put him out of wrestling for quite a while. Note that Eddie's doctor is none other than the notorious George Zahorian of steroids fame.
3. I've never seen a guy climb the turnbuckle to break a collar-and-elbow the way Rene does here.
4. Gino mentions that he'd been in Bradford, Pennsylvania "yesterday" Actually, it was two days before; he must have been the agent for their sold-out card (fifteen hundred people) at the high school gym. In the only match with a result given, Ivan Putski beat Mr. Fuji.
5. Gino criticizes the referee for this match for being too slow, then says that Dick Woerhle will be "buried" in that night's main event. Rightly or wrongly, he's the only announcer I've ever known who's criticized the referees so harshly.
6, Rene does something that very few wrestlers bothered to do even back in the day, as he sells his ear after breaking Eddie's side headlock.
7, Gino and Dick engage in a nice little discussion of the side headlock's effects, and Gino actually talks about why you seldom get a pin using it. It's nice to actually hear nuts-and-bolts wrestling talk in a way that's not possible during squash matches.
More below!
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8, For the first time n this thread (though surely not the last), we get an incomprehensible blooper from Dick, as he refers to Mr. Gilbert as "Eddie Murphy".
9, At one point, Rene uses a foreign object that he picked up off the canvas. Dick calls it a peanut shell, and Eddie sells it like death. For all of you peanut eaters out there, if you knew a wrestler who claimed that he used a peanut shell as a foreign object, could you believe him?
10. The best sequence of what had been a very basic match to that point cane when Rene snapped Eddie's neck off the top rope to send him to the floor. Moments later, when it was time for him to get back in the ring and Rene tried to stop him, he returned the favor with a neck snap of his own,
11. You wouldn't think that a guy like Rene, with his average size for a wrestler and lack of physique, would use the claw as a submission hold, but he does here (with the aid of a possibly loaded glove),
12. When Gine criticized the commission refs, was he speaking for Vince or acting on his own? I need to know that before I talk about his criticisms. If he's knocking them for doing their jobs as instructed, he's a jerk, as are those who agree with him. If he's speaking for the promotion, why didn't Vince and his people work with these guys and tell them how they wanted the matches called?
I need one more small post to finish up. More below!
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13. How in the world can a wrestling announcer not tell the difference between a dropkick, a boot to the ribs, and a kneelft? Ask Dick!
14. The match was declared a draw, but the bell never rang. The referee just tapped Eddie on the back, and that was it.
Next: To be determined.
Thoughts?
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I think the early announcing days of Gino Monsoon was filled with a lot of him proving he was the authority on everything. Maybe he felt he needed to do this.
As he began to work with other people, Dick Graham, Vince, Pat Patterson and later Jesse and Heenan, of course, he began to give a more relaxed performance and the real Gino came out.  :
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This message was edited by garretta on November 27th, 2023 00:04 GMT
Wasn't he an agent for the Spectrum cards? He might have been sending a message to the refs he thought weren't doing their jobs (though saying that Eddie should have decked the ref in this match was going too far regardless).
The spot I was talking about was when Rene bit Eddie in the forehead while applying the claw. Either the ref legitimately didn't see it because of Rene's glove or didn't call it, whether he was acting on his own or going along with the booking. Regardless, Gino threw a fit and got Dick (whose knowledge of wrestling was questionable at best) to go along with him.
Incidentally, I know Dick was a professor at one of the many colleges in the Philly area. Did PRISM ever use him on anything else? I wouldn't think that he'd be part of the Phillies, Sixers or Flyers broadcasts, but maybe he hosted some of their movies.
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This message was edited by garretta on November 28th, 2023 02:59 GMT
The main event I mentioned above was an eight-man tag, best two out of three falls: Andre, Rocky Johnson, Tony Atlas, and Jimmy Snuka against all three Samoans and Sgt. Slaughter. The face team won two falls to one, with Andre, as usual, getting the decisive fall by sitting on Afa for the three-count.
Other matches Dick mentioned were a midget tag, Don Muraco defending the IC title against Sal Bellomo (Muraco went over by pinfall, but Sal lasted ten minutes), Bob Backlund losing by countout against the Masked Superstar, and Tito Santana getting a World title shot against the Iron Sheik. (Both men were disqualified.)
Full results can be found at The History of WWE website.
More reviews coming soon!
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This message was edited by garretta on November 29th, 2023 02:10 GMT
My first attempt at a post was eaten, so on we go to the Boston Garden on Saturday, August 15, 1987. Iron Mike Sharpe is taking on Brady Boons, and your announcers for NESN (New England Sports Network) are Lord Alfred Hayes and Slick:
1, First of, where the devil was Gino? Lord Alfred had never done play-by-play before, and to put him with a rptating triumvirate of Jimmy Hart, Johnny Valiant, and Slick would have been tough for a veteran like Gino, let alone a complete novice.
2. Even though Slick was in the building, he hadn't accompanied Nikolai Volkoff to the ring earlier that night for his match against Paul Orndorff. Paul won by pinfall.
3. Howard Finkel makes a rare Beantown appearance as the ring announcer.
4. I love Lord's motto when it comes to Iron Mike: "If it moves, dropkick it!"
5. There really is no honor among thieves; when Iron Mike takes a spill on the announce table, the first thing Slick does is wave him off, as if to say "Get the hell away from me!"
6. The Slickster is very low-key and respectful here, possibly because he's working with Lord Alfred. He shows a bit more of his "true" character when Lord asks him about his plans to send the One Man Gang after Hogan.
More below!
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This message was edited by garretta on November 29th, 2023 02:56 GMT
7. Even though there's a definite face-heel dynamic in play between His Lordship and Slick, they also spend more time than you would think discussing the strategy of the match, particularly when it comes to Iron Mike. Slick actually sounds like he guides wrestlers for a living, which is more than you can say for guys like Valiant and Hart; those two treat the announce table as just another place to cut promos.
8. Iron Mike wins with by loading his brace and whacking Brady with it; the referee was distracted, trying to push Brady out of the corner. Time of the match: 9:34.
9. I noticed the little bit of hope in Lord's voice when he saw the referee talking to Howard, as if he (the ref) was going to reverse the decision he had just made.
10. This match followed the main event of the evening: a six-man elimination match with the Harts and the Honky Tonk Man facing Tito Santana, Jake Roberts and Bruno Sammartino, Bruno scored the winning pinfall on Honky. Despite Brunp's iconic status in Boston, the card drew only 7,004, less than half capacity.
11. The next match featured Gang against Hillbilly Jim, but according to the History of WWE, Slick wasn't at ringside with Gang either; apparently he was there just to be a commentator. Hillbilly won by countout when Little Beaver distracted Gang on the floor. Gang retaliated by splashing him, much like King Kong Bundy had dropped an elbow on him at Mania III.
12. This match aired Monday, August 31, 1987 on Prime Time Wrestling.
13. Brady looked decent here; nothing special, but good enough to accomplish his mission here. His dropkicks could use a ton of work, though, did he ever hit one full force?
Next: To be determined.
Thoughts?
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This message was edited by garretta on November 30th, 2023 01:54 GMT
Back to the Spectrum we go for our next match, as S.D. Jones battles the Honky Tonk Man (without Jimmy Hart). The date is Saturday. December 13. 1986, and your announcers for PRISM are Gorilla Monsoon and Dick Graham:
1, This match took place right after the infamous "vote of confidence" that solidified Honky's heel turn. As I remember, he hadn't done anything heelish up to that point to suggest that the turn was coming; one day, he was "shaking hands and kissing babies", to use his own words, and the next day he was with Jimmy Hart and getting booed out of every building he set foot in.
2. Even six months before he won the Intercontinental title, he doesn't look fully attired without the belt around his waist.
3, I didn't know that S.D. had been sick sometime in 1983 or '84. Dick certainly scooped the magazines with that little nugget.
4. Dick credits Joe Namath with the saying "It ain't bragging if you can do it". Joe may have said it at some point, but I'll always associate that particular saying with Muhammad Ali,
5. S.D. is announced at 256 pounds, but at one point Gino says that he's over three hundred. My guess is that Gino liked the phrase "three hundred pounds plus" and used it whenever he thought he could get away with it, because S.D. looks about 265 at the most here.
6. Honky hits S.D. in the forehead with several blows, including a flying fistdrop, and S.D. sells them despite supposedly having a harder head than normal. Maybe the hard head stereotype is only supposed to count for headbutts and turnbuckle rams.
7. Honky gets the win with Shake, Rattle, and Roll. Time of the fall: 7:32.
8. The main event of this card was the Philly blowoff of the Hogan-Orndorff feud. Hogan won a cage match by escape at 8:04. The card drew 14,132.
9. Honky always claimed that only three people voted against him: Junkyard Dog, Hulk Hogan, and Jack Tunney. In most promotions, that would mean eventual feuds with JYD and Hogan.
I understand that Hogan had more important fish to fry, but why did Honky not work a single match with JYD that I've ever heard of? JYD-Race was a decent feud, and Jake Roberts made his feud with Honky better than it could have been, but it seems like Vince ignored a door that was already open.
Next: To be determined.
Thoughts?
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 drjonah |
December 01st, 2023 21:42 GMT |
 
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Couple thoughts.
1)How many times did Dick Graham say 'WHOA!' during each card? 
2)From everything I've heard, Gorilla HATED the athletic commission refs with a passion because they would screw up in matches and take their job way too seriously.
3)Gorilla saying SD Jones was 'over 300 pounds' was his tongue in cheek way of saying SD was getting fat. There was a period of time where SD started to gain weight but not in muscle and Gino was the only one who would point it out and get away with it.
4)Slick being respectful probably had a lot to do with him being a real life minister and since he was going to be out there the whole night, probably didn't want to be 'in character' the whole time
5)HTM name dropping JYD and Hogan, eh sounds like freestyling since he was basically mentioning the 2 top babyfaces and the 'president' of the WWF. Being a territory guy it was usually custom in promos to name drop some of the top people even if you were never going to work with them.
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http://www.thehistoryofwwe.com
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This message was edited by Eater of the Dead on December 01st, 2023 22:17 GMT
Regarding gorilla hating the athletic Commission refs, I know this isn't exactly the same thing, but Sam muchnick would instruct his referees to play their role straight, and regardless of what the finish was supposed to be..... it was up to the wrestlers to get to that finish....that is it was the wrestlers fault if their shoulders were counted down for a 3 count if that wasn't the finish, it wasn't the refs responsibility to do damage control.
It sounds like gorilla wanted things both ways. He wanted the sport of wrestling to be taken seriously and be treated as a legit contest, yet at the same time he didn't want the refs to take themselves too seriously. You can't have it both ways, the refs should take themselves seriously if the goal was to present wrestling as a legit sport.
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Right u are about Sam Muchnick EOD. about the Refs. Mike Figuroa the Illinois Ref back in the day would count you out especially if he didn't like you.
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This message was edited by garretta on December 07th, 2023 03:30 GMT
Our next bout comes from the Mecca of professional wrestling, Madison Square Garden, as Terry Funk (wjth Jimmy Hart) battles Scott McGhee, The date is Monday, January 27, 1986, and your announcers are Gorilla Monsoon and Jesse "The Body" Ventura:
1. This match aired on the Monday, February 17, 1986 edition of Prime Time Wrestling.
2. I think Terry's televised obliteration of Mel Phillips is in the Aldo Marino comp that Job Guy put together. I'll get to that when I start the '85 thread shortly, but in this bout, we see that Terry still hasn't forgiven Mel and is extremely reluctant to let Mel carry his ring attire back to the locker room.
3. We very seldom heard about Jimmy's musical background on WWF television, even when it could have been considered relevant, like when they talked about his album (I think it was called Outrageous Conduct). Was Vince afraid that the fans would like the music and start cheering the man who was responsible for it?
4. Somebody must have really been a fan of McGhee's to allow him to look this good against a guy who had just gotten two televised matches with Hogan and was feuding with the number two babyface in the company (JYD). Most guys in Scotty's position would have been guzzled in less than five minutes, MSG or no MSG.
(In addition to the SNME match with Hogan that you may remember, Terry also got a televised World title shot at the Spectrum in December 1985.)
5. Nice to see a bit of turnabout, as Jimmy's continual distraction of the referee allows Scotty to choke Terry with his wrist tape in retaliation for Terry doing the same to Scotty earlier.
6. Having said that, three distraction spots in a little over a minute is two too many. One of them should have been eliminated altogether, and the other two needed to be spread out a lot further. Terry's more than capable of causing mayhem on his own; he doesn't need this much help from Jimmy.
7. Unexpected Move of the Match: Terry's sunset flip off the top for a two and a half count. Scotty turns right around and gets a rollup of his own, also for two and a half.
8. The finish sees Scotty disable Terry with a back suplex, then climb to the top. He files, but Terry raises his knees and catches him in the head, which stuns Scotty enough to keep him down for three. Time of the fall: 9:44.
9, After the match, Scotty's branded once, but manages to avoid a second branding and rolls out of the ring, returning seconds later with a chair. Terry and Jimmy quickly head for the hills, as does Howard Finkel.
10, This seems like a condensed version of a match that these two may have had in another place and time. Take Jimmy's spots and the branding out of the picture, add ten minutes, and it would have been a good fit for most NWA territories five or ten years earlier.
11. The main event of the card, which drew 20,225, was the rematch between Hogan and Randy Savage for the World title. Savage scored his second consecutive counout win at MSG thanks to Liz's distractions, and their final confrontation in the Big Apple for over three years came in February, when Hogan got the pinfall win in a lumberjack match.
Next: To be determined.
Thoughts?
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This message was edited by garretta on December 07th, 2023 20:59 GMT
Continuing our focus on Scott McGhee, in our next match he tackles another of Jimmy Hart's men, Jim "The Anvil" Neidhart. We're at the Boston Garden on Saturday, March 8, 1986, and your announcers for NESN are Gorilla Monsoon and Lord Alfred Hayes:
1. The Anvil starts the match by effortlessly throwing Scotty to the canvas off of a collar-and-elbow. Scotty tries another lockup with the same result, but the Anvil turns his back to celebrate, and Scotty rolls him up for a two-count. I've never seen a sequence like that before, at least not in the WWF.
2. I'm not sure whether Gino and His Lordship's constant comments about Jimmy's megaphone are a subtle tool to put him over or what, but they're getting to be as distracting as the megaphone itself.
I don't necessarily blame the announcers, though; I blame the jerk who thought that giving a naturally hyper guy like Jimmy a megaphone in the first place was a good idea. It may have seemed like one when it was first brought up, and I'll concede that it made Jimmy stand out. But didn't his voice and his jackets do the same? The megaphone just seems like too much of a good thing.
3. I wonder if Jimmy custom designed his megaphones the way he did his jackets? You certainly don't find horns like that at the local Radio Shack.
4. Jimmy does a quick interview with Gino where he complains about the Dream Team (which he owned half of when it was first formed because of his association with Valentine) not giving Brat and the Anvil a shot at the tag team titles.
This leads to an interesting question: What if, instead of Valiant taking over as Valentine's manager, Jimmy had taken over as Beefcake's manager? Would Bret and the Anvil have stayed a team? Would Valiant have stayed a manager, perhaps taken over Blassie's stable in place of Slick if they could have talked Freddie into retiring a year earlier?
5. The interview ends with Jimmy sounding the siren right in Gino's ear. In spite of what I said up above, and as much as I love Gino, that got a chuckle out of me,
6. Before I forget, a question for those of you who might have gone to shows at the Boston Garden in the mid-eighties: What was the ring announcer's name? Finkel did MSG and was identified, Mel Phillips and Gary Cappetta did most of the announcing at the Spectrum and were identified, but the guy in Boston (and Providence too, I think) was never identified.
7. The Anvil gets the win with a beautiful powerslam at 5:59.
8. Gino mentions that both members of the Hart Foundation were in singles matches that night. Bret's match was the much talked about classic against Ricky Steamboat. (Steamer won by pinfall.)
9, The main event of this card was Hogan and JYD against the Funks (with Jimmy). Hogan scored the winning fall on Terry in 10;21. A sellout crowd of 16, 390 was on hand,
10. This match aired Monday, March 31 on Prime Time.
Next: To be determined.
Thoughts?
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Quoted from: Eater of the Dead, December 01st, 2023 22:15 GMTRegarding gorilla hating the athletic Commission refs, I know this isn't exactly the same thing, but Sam muchnick would instruct his referees to play their role straight, and regardless of what the finish was supposed to be..... it was up to the wrestlers to get to that finish....that is it was the wrestlers fault if their shoulders were counted down for a 3 count if that wasn't the finish, it wasn't the refs responsibility to do damage control.
It sounds like gorilla wanted things both ways. He wanted the sport of wrestling to be taken seriously and be treated as a legit contest, yet at the same time he didn't want the refs to take themselves too seriously. You can't have it both ways, the refs should take themselves seriously if the goal was to present wrestling as a legit sport.
Agreed. That was the old school way. I trained at a wrestling school and this is what they taught.
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